If you believed in the Almighty Mystical Smoking
Head of Bob, and that in the next life he would
make you a Lector Priest Adjutant to the Chiefs
of Staff of the Army of General Jack Cosmo... and
you believed this with ALL YOUR HEART...
Would this be your destination in the afterlife?
What I mean to say is... is Ultimate Reality INFINITE, and constantly in a state of flux, if you will?
Just as Christians see Jesus, and Muslims see
Mohammed, and Buddhists see Buddha... Might a
Church of Bob member (a deliberately silly joke religion which, don't worry, I DON'T believe in) who was perhaps insane, and TRULY BELIEVED in the reality of Bob... even if he/she was the ONLY human to ever truly believe in Bob... see Bob when he/she died, and perhaps go on to be Bob's military Lector Priest as I imagined above?
Whatcha all think?

B-man

Make believe??? but I'm in line to be Bob's Executive Assistant Smoking Head! It can't be make believe!

Anyway, if the places described in retrievals are accurate, then how can it not be accurate to think Bob's believer will see Bob? Besides, I personally don't think Bob is any more silly than Jesus or Mohammed, though I will possibly rate a Christian Jihad for saying so. Why waste time hanging around in Heaven with Jesus or with limitless Muslim virgins (why is someone's idea of Heaven the opportunity to pop a cherry, if you will pardon the language?) when I can be exploring my own creativity and the limits of my own conciousness?

So, you either accept the reports of others on their retrievals or egt your own personal "evidence" about belief system Territories, or you don't.

This highlights a real source of conflict on this board. Some of us accept, and some don't. If Belief system Territories are outside the experience of someone and that someone doesn't want to accept them or doesn't think they seem plausible in some larger philosophical context, then perhaps that someone would be happier at another board. If an experience of belief system Territories OR something analagously strange are part of my personal experience, then no amopunt of logical argument, no matter how tight or intellectually correct it is, will change my mind about BSTs existence. The one with the most intellectually correct arguments doesn't win.

There are many stories of people being involved in strange afterlife experiences. where would you like to start? Bruce's books have stories that I think answer your question. Maybe you were just asking for more stories?

Well I don't have any great strange Retrieval Stories, but I think some of the ideas we take during living are on examination so strange that I have no problem thinking that someone who believes in this Bob dude you postulate would see Bob on dying. I mean, look at all the cultures we humans have created and how different they are and how all of them, at some point in history and for some maybe brief time, were successful. If all were at some point successful, how can you say one is "right" and the rest are "wrong"? (Have you ever read any of Jared Diamond's work?) Look at all the successful languages there have been through history! And when we get to Heaven, do we all suddenly speak English? Well aren't belief systems like cultures, or like languages? Something we take on to use for a while. So if someone wants to take the language of Bob whe they get to "Heaven" well. good for them! They should go for it. That sort of thing is what we are all doing anyway.

Yes!  However, there are always higher beings who are working at getting your attention in the afterlife for your spiritual growth. So one wouldn't be 'stuck' with following Bob for eternity.  ;D

Love, Mairlyn ;-)

Quote:

So, you either accept the reports of others on their retrievals or egt your  personal "evidence" about belief system Territories, or you don't.

Except, in my understandings  that the "belief system territories" doesn't start in "afterlife" it is start here, there are not much  difference between * here and there,* until in transition period we'll shed our objective beliefs...

Any belief system that what we hold strongly holds US ! It eliminates many of our choices, for we may only see even more selectively and narrowly within that belief system. therefor we allow  no information beyond that belief system.. As we  accept the belief system, not with the intention of changing or eliminating the belief system, but acknowledging that it is reality and that it is accepted, it loses its power, therefore losing its hold, allowing us more choices.

I'm aware that my understanding is unpopular, but only with self knowledge and understanding what are the beliefs and how they influence our "evidence" understanding the difference between true and truth is the key...


Quote:

If an experience of belief system Territories OR something analagously strange are part of my personal experience, then no amopunt of logical argument, no matter how tight or intellectually correct it is, will change my mind about BSTs existence. The one with the most intellectually correct arguments doesn't win.

Yes! Because with lack of understanding that all experience even though are real and true who experience them, but they're not truths
They're colored by perception and beliefs!!!


Quote:

This highlights a real source of conflict on this board.

The real conflict is that if you read with attention, there are hardly ever any beliefs *here*  what is  mentioned don't matter how much of a pot-pourri they are, they convinced that theirs the one and only truth...... Some hold on to theirs stronger then other, In this, some  also fight more diligently in defense of these belief systems. This should  be the  initial indication. approch ing another individual and  faced with the belief systems of another individual to which we  disagree,should be  examined  first before  responsed.The more vehemently they are expressing to another individual the rightness of their stance, the more they are indicating to themselves the intensity of the belief system that they hold.

Therefore even though in my understanding there are truths what apply all dimensions, but those truths are not associated with beliefs and long as we physically manifested what we have is our own true our own interpretations but none of them are truths because beliefs influence beliefs, and beliefs influence perception, and perception creates our reality.

So believe in Smoking Head Bob, are no different then belive in anything else, long as it is understood that is for some a   preference and choice in beliefs -even if we disagree with it,  but they're just beliefs  as ours, and that understanding eliminate the conflict and trauma...

Dora:

Quote:
beliefs influence beliefs, and beliefs influence perception, and perception creates our reality.

I absolutely BELIEVE that!  Right on!

love, blink

wrote on May 21^st, 2005 at 7:30am:

Just as Christians see Jesus, and Muslims see Mohammed, and Buddhists see Buddha... B-man

Buddhists try to become a Buddha,  Buddhism is much much different then the two religions you mentioned. many do not even consider it a religion.

I'm not sure I'd want to worship OR become an almighty mystical smoking head. But I do have to admit that being a Lector Priest Adjutant to the Chiefs of Staff of the Army of General Jack Cosmo sounds oddly intriguing. Do they have a health plan? How about a 401K?

I'm not sure I'd want to worship OR become an almighty mystical smoking head. But I do have to admit that being a Lector Priest Adjutant to the Chiefs of Staff of the Army of General Jack Cosmo sounds oddly intriguing. Do they have a health plan? How about a 401K?
*******************************
I'd like to think that I could dictate whatever terms I liked... health plans, 401K, or my daily ganja ration and babe allotment...

wrote on May 30^th, 2005 at 12:15am:

******************************* I'd like to think that I could dictate whatever terms I liked... health plans, 401K, or my daily ganja ration and babe allotment...

well, I'm married so i don't think the babe allotment would go down well with my wife... but the daily ganja ration sounds pretty good.  

As long as it is "church" sanctioned!